Steve Pamon on How to Create Moments That Matter
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Today’s Trapital episode, you’ll hear Verzuz CEO Steve Pamon. He’s one of the smartest people I know in the entertainment business. It was one of our most highly-rated sessions. We talked about creating value for fans with live events, what music can learn from Beyoncé, the NFL, WWE, IMAX, and more.
You can listen here or read below for his insightful 8-10-12 framework.
Does your event deliver on 8 - 10 - 12?
When I asked Trapital Summit attendees what stuck with them most from the day, one concept stood out: 8-10-12.
It’s Steve Pamon‘s framework for creating value with live events, and it’s simple yet memorable:
“We used to have on the whiteboard at Parkwood [Entertainment], divided up into three columns: 8-10-12. 8 is the cost of whatever event we’re putting on. 12 is the value we want to create. 10 is the price.
So we want people to feel like when they come to the Formation World Tour… we want to feel like, ‘Man, these guys overdid it.’ Because no matter what the price is, if you feel like you got more than what you paid for, guess what you’re gonna end up doing? Coming back.”
The beauty of 8-10-12 is its clarity. You’re not just breaking even or maximizing profits. You’re creating a value gap that makes people feel like they won. And when people feel like they won, they come back time and time again.
Steve went deeper on how storytelling elevates that value:
“If you and I go to the LA Rams game, it’s not uncommon for 40 to 50% of everyone attending to be wearing the uniform or merchandise. Why isn’t that way at a concert? So we intended to do that, starting out with Formation. And you see what happened with Cowboy Carter? 40 to 50% of everyone was dressed in the theme and motif. Renaissance, they’re all dressed in disco and silver.
That’s to create that fandom because it’s not just her on the stage. The stage is the entire venue. But once you get that going back to 8 - 10 - 12. Once you get people believing they’re part of the story, if we can keep producing that at a reasonable cost, charging a bit more, it becomes circular, not linear.”
When half the arena shows up in a costume, you’ve turned attendees into cast members. The value they’re getting isn’t just the show, it’s being part of something bigger. That’s how the value gets to 12. That’s how you build a franchise.
A lot of people in entertainment talk about building franchises. “We are building the next Disney.” “We want to be the New York Yankees.” For many, it’s a great mood board aspiration, but can they turn it into a reality? The real measure of a franchise’s power is sustained popularity even when the underlying product occasionally misses the mark.
A subpar NFL game still gets high ratings because it’s the NFL. Similarly, even when discourse is polarizing about Beyoncé’s latest work, the Beyoncé franchise sustains because 8-10-12 holds over time. Cowboy Carter won the major Grammy award but still sparked debate about whether it matched the quality of her previous albums. The Cowboy Carter Tour set records but also faced questions about its pricing strategy. Despite the critiques, both still delivered on the brand promise that came from decades of Beyoncé overdelivering for those fans.
That’s the strength of a franchise: the accumulated trust from years of making people feel like they got more than they paid for.
The real test of 8-10-12 isn’t just one time. It’s building systems that consistently create consumer surplus. That’s what turns events into memorable moments.
Listen here: Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Overcast